Cedar Point | Top Thrill 2 | Triple Launch Renovation | 2024

[Trax]

To be clear: I am not making fun of Zamperla because they where chosen over Intamin - but because they where chosen above anyone else.

Zamperla fastet ride is 35m tall and their highest speed is 90 km/h. Mack, B&M, S&S, Vekoma, Premier, RMC, Intamin, they’ve all built higher and taller rides. They have more experience with extreme coasters than Zamperla could ever had.

Zamperla is known for sub-Par Family coasters, yet the park decided they were the right ones to trust with the world's tallest coaster. This is why I’m making fun of them. From my point of view, they could’ve gone with SBF Visa and gotten the same results.
Zamperla made some very obvious mistakes, showing their lack of expertise for a ride of this scale early on. Their wheel bogeys had to be beefed up by a lot, because they were breaking after 3 days of operation!

Intamin would’ve been the obvious choice as the original manufacturer. And, they do have some, albeit limited, experience with such extreme speeds and heights. They’ve done it before, the know how isn’t lost. They have the experience to avoid some of the traps Zamperla fell in.
Other manufacturers have proven their expertise in tall and fast coasters, making them a valid alternative as you know that they’d enter new grounds, but have at least worked on equally as intense rides and should be able to construct a train that is up for the task.

From all the manufacturers they could’ve picked, they went with (one of the) worst. That is why I am mocking them. They wanted to do that.
And if you ask me, the reason is very simple: Zamperla were the cheapest. I am sure they wanted this job to show their (lack of) expertise, and where willing to accept a lower profit margin due to this.

 

[MackMan]

I guess Cedar Fair will put Zamperla on their blacklist after this.. TT2 is certainly a tricky project but to be honest I think another period of downtime is pushing it after last year..

Zamperla's portfolio is okay in my opinion, some standard family coasters. Their thrill coasters are generally known for being rough or poorly designed (Volares).. Maybe they'll try Skyline next year for Top Thrill 3?

 

[Hyde]

They have the experience to avoid some of the traps Zamperla fell in.
Other manufacturers have proven their expertise in tall and fast coasters, making them a valid alternative as you know that they’d enter new grounds, but have at least worked on equally as intense rides and should be able to construct a train that is up for the task.

We know Intamin bid on the TT2 project, at what sounds a more expensive price-point than Zamperla. One can be led to assume Intamin may have bid something like a bigger Red Force, maybe with larger, more extensive track modification for fitting in a one-pass LSM launch that would drive up the cost. As for other manufacturers, no clue.

Again, beating dead horse here, but I still posit Intamin's track record is less sterling than is easy to recall of recent history. Especially for the "relatively" new coaster enthusiasts who have Pantheon, VelociCoaster, Batman Gotham City, etc. in the rear-view of their memory; there's a long list of Intamin rides over the last 20 years that have ridden the struggle bus hard, especially for creations above the 300 ft./90 MPH mark. Chronic launch downtimes (hydraulic and LSM alike), track reprofiling (remember the three iterations of I305/Pantherian?), and a host of other mechanic downtimes. Even Gold Rusher at SFOG remains with weird downtime issues/still not at full design operation.

I do feel I'm trying to have a two-factor debate at the same time; both on the premise there's no safe bet manufacturer, nor a safe bet 300/400+ ft. coaster. It only takes a simple perusal of the RCDB record holder page to find a smattering of SBNO, removed, or significantly modified roller coasters.

Absolutely love Intamin roller coasters as some of the greatest in the world and embrace them with their mechanical faults and flaws. I want Falcon's Flight to be an unfettered success later this year and hope the unforeseen park budget helps drive all the maintenance and attention that ride will require. But if we did see any additional ride closure delay, I would also not be surprised on the simple premise (to my original point): building tall, fast roller coasters is hard.

 

[Trax]

I do agree that a ride if this scale will always have some issues. No manufacturer has enough experience with this size and speed to be able to build it in a way that they’ll run without issues. Pushing the limits does mean that you’re also pushing your own ones.

Apparently it is already testing again, maybe someone has a photo?

 

[roomraider]

To be clear: I am not making fun of Zamperla because they where chosen over Intamin - but because they where chosen above anyone else.

Zamperla fastet ride is 35m tall and their highest speed is 90 km/h. Mack, B&M, S&S, Vekoma, Premier, RMC, Intamin, they’ve all built higher and taller rides. They have more experience with extreme coasters than Zamperla could ever had.

Zamperla is known for sub-Par Family coasters, yet the park decided they were the right ones to trust with the world's tallest coaster. This is why I’m making fun of them. From my point of view, they could’ve gone with SBF Visa and gotten the same results.
Zamperla made some very obvious mistakes, showing their lack of expertise for a ride of this scale early on. Their wheel bogeys had to be beefed up by a lot, because they were breaking after 3 days of operation!

Intamin would’ve been the obvious choice as the original manufacturer. And, they do have some, albeit limited, experience with such extreme speeds and heights. They’ve done it before, the know how isn’t lost. They have the experience to avoid some of the traps Zamperla fell in.
Other manufacturers have proven their expertise in tall and fast coasters, making them a valid alternative as you know that they’d enter new grounds, but have at least worked on equally as intense rides and should be able to construct a train that is up for the task.

From all the manufacturers they could’ve picked, they went with (one of the) worst. That is why I am mocking them. They wanted to do that.
And if you ask me, the reason is very simple: Zamperla were the cheapest. I am sure they wanted this job to show their (lack of) expertise, and where willing to accept a lower profit margin due to this.

We say they could have gone with these manufacturers but I've seen no evidence they even put a bid in.

With Mack and Vekoma fully booked for a while, B&M and RMC would never bid on something like this and maybe companies like S&S and Premier know their limits. If Intamin and Zamperla were 2 of only 2 or 3 bids and Intamin's was way too expensive then it makes sense why they went for Zamperla.

 

[Hyde]

I do agree that a ride if this scale will always have some issues. No manufacturer has enough experience with this size and speed to be able to build it in a way that they’ll run without issues. Pushing the limits does mean that you’re also pushing your own ones.

Apparently it is already testing again, maybe someone has a photo?

Running presently (gratefully)!

 

[rollercoaster.jpg]

I've been a thoosie for a really long time (~25 years) so I might be a bit more patient than most. However, I think it's still too early to deem TT2 a success or failure. In fact, I think it's actually *passed* it's first major hurdle: reviews from riders are almost universally positive. Considering how contentious the retrofit was, that's a huge WIN in itself.

Like most, I was a bit surprised when Zamperla was first announced. However, after IAAPA, I realized they'd put together a pretty compelling sales pitch. They'd hired new talent with extensive experience (including an ex-Intamin CEO/engineer) and were using TT2 as a prestige project to launch their revamped coaster division. I'm sure they cut Cedar Point a good deal, but I don't think that was the only deciding factor. The Lightning trains also promised a lot of quiet innovations (like eliminating welds to reduce maintance and third-party NDT).

There are lots of coasters that had rough opening years (or were delayed a year) that've since lived long successful lives. In the timescale of a roller coaster's service life, early issues become less and less important or are mostly forgotten. I rode Dragster opening year and it was pretty disasterous. I waited 4+ hours after being completely thwarted several times. It was so common for Dragster to to be SBNO they had slips of paper prepared. I actually kept one as a souvenir!

 

[rollercoaster.jpg]

Especially for the "relatively" new coaster enthusiasts who have Pantheon, VelociCoaster, Batman Gotham City, etc. in the rear-view of their memory...

I completely agree with the points you made, but it's a bit funny you chose those examples because all three had issues their opening year.

• Pantheon had pretty extensive issues with restraint sensors that caused frequent operational issues and downtime.
• Velocicoaster had problems melting/wearing out wheels (although it was resolved quickly; maybe Univeral is willing to replace wheels more frequently then expected?).
• Batman Gotham City had some intermitent downtime and stalled on its tophat atleast twice.

As others have already said, all coasters have a break-in period. In engineering, failure is often described as a "bathtub curve". At first, there is a high-rate of failure during the initial break-in period. Then things settle down and failure rates are relatively flat (the bottom of the bathtub). Failure rates spike again towards the end of service life.

Hopefully TT2 is almost done with the "start-up comissioning" phase and we're entering a long reliable service life

 

[davidm]

Just for posterity;